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Thread: Estimate on Unloading of Cement

  1. #1
    panos Guest

    Estimate on Unloading of Cement

    Very basic info about unloading Cement and transfer to silos

    Dear All,

    I need a very-very rough estimate of a setup where ships carrying bulk cement dust are to be unloaded and then cement is to be transferred to silos.

    The cost request is about the
    1. Unloading mechanism (vacuum),
    2. the conveying
    3 and finally the silos.

    The unloading rate should be in the area of a 30 ton ship in approx two to three days.
    And the silos capacity must be approx 100.000mt.

    I know that for a precise calculation a lot of more input is needed, but I don't have the extra input right now and the rough estimate must be there.

    So, any help is greatly appreciated.

    Regards

    Panos

  2. #2
    Teus Tuinenburg

    Professional Experience 50 Years / 8 Month Teus Tuinenburg has 50 Years and 8 Month professional experience

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    Searching Falsifications in my perception of pneumatic conveying

    Know-How Conveying (1374) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 1374 times, Pneumatic Conveying (1179) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 1179 times, Pneumatic (45) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 45 times

    Dear panos,

    You have probably an import terminal in mind.

    A pneumatic cement unloader is the obvious way to go as I can say out of vast experience in cement unloading and cement silo installations.
    The installation costs are very depending on the ship size.
    Ship size determines demurrage and therefore the unloading capacity.
    Annual throughput also determines the capacity and the necessary reliability of the installation.
    Energy consumption is a very important factor in operating cost.
    Diesel driven or electrically driven?
    Etc.

    The advice is to write an extensive specification with explicitely mentioned equipment and performance, rather than general phrases.

    However, a silo storage capacity of 100000 mt in combination with a ship of only 30 tons must be an error.
    To fill the silo you need 100000/30 = 3333 ships.
    I think that you have to review that figure.

    Best regards
    Teus
    Teus

  3. #3
    Teus Tuinenburg

    Professional Experience 50 Years / 8 Month Teus Tuinenburg has 50 Years and 8 Month professional experience

    Discussions 1805 Teus Tuinenburg acceded to 1805 discussions, Articles 10 Teus Tuinenburg wrote 10 articles, Publications 0 Teus Tuinenburg Tuinenburg released 0 publications

    Searching Falsifications in my perception of pneumatic conveying

    Know-How Conveying (1374) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 1374 times, Pneumatic Conveying (1179) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 1179 times, Pneumatic (45) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 45 times

    Dear Panos,

    Also have a look at:

    http://blog.bulk-online.com/?p=74

    Success
    Teus
    Teus

  4. #4
    panos Guest
    Dear Teus,

    Thanks for the prompt response.

    You are right about the ship size. I meant 30.000 tons.

    Though the silo capacity is correct. It is 100.000 mt.

    The year round turnover is going to be ~1.000.000 mt

    In our case there is no demurrage, the port is privately owned by the people I represent.

    At the moment, and until a proper study is in order, all I want is a figure -very approximate- of the purchasing and installation cost of a pneumatic cement unloader plus silos for 100.000 mt.

    Is it 1.000.000€ is it 20.000.000€ or 100.000.000€ ?? (Diesel or electrically driven).

    Thanks in advance.

    Panos

  5. Cement unloader

    Dear Sir
    We are pleased to offer several Surplus Cement Unloaders for this application. Please keep us in mind for Barge Mounted machines as well as Portable Trailer mounted units.
    Please feel free to contact us for additional information.
    Sincerely,
    Al Goodmundson
    Email norsequip@sasktel.net

  6. #6
    Teus Tuinenburg

    Professional Experience 50 Years / 8 Month Teus Tuinenburg has 50 Years and 8 Month professional experience

    Discussions 1805 Teus Tuinenburg acceded to 1805 discussions, Articles 10 Teus Tuinenburg wrote 10 articles, Publications 0 Teus Tuinenburg Tuinenburg released 0 publications

    Searching Falsifications in my perception of pneumatic conveying

    Know-How Conveying (1374) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 1374 times, Pneumatic Conveying (1179) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 1179 times, Pneumatic (45) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 45 times

    Dear Panos,

    Estimating a price of “something” is very difficult.
    At least you have to know the “something”.

    Based on your figures:

    Unloading a cement vessel of 30.000 dwt in 3 days means 10.000 tons/day
    Assuming 20 working hrs/day, means an average unloading rate of 500 tons/hr through the ship capacity.
    Assuming an unloading efficiency of 50% , results in a design capacity of 1000 tons/hr.
    The number of working days/year is then 100 out of 200 normal working days.

    A 1000 tons/hr pneumatic cement unloader for 30.000 dwt ships is not yet built in the world as far as I know.

    1 unit of approx. 500 tons/hr can do the job in 200 days/year, although the ship will be in port for 7 days (which is normal) instead of 3 days. A storage capacity of approx. 45000 tons inverse cone silos should be sufficient.

    In case you want to unload in three days, it might be a good idea to go for 2 unloaders of 500 tons/hr for back-up reasons.

    A preliminary terminal design with silos and unloaders can easily be made in 2 weeks and based on this preliminary design, the price estimates can be asked from the respective companies.

    see also:

    http://www.bulk-online.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=8408

    success
    Teus
    Teus

  7. #7
    panos Guest
    Thanks Teus for your help.

    I read this thread.

    Regards

    Panos

  8. #8
    Teus Tuinenburg

    Professional Experience 50 Years / 8 Month Teus Tuinenburg has 50 Years and 8 Month professional experience

    Discussions 1805 Teus Tuinenburg acceded to 1805 discussions, Articles 10 Teus Tuinenburg wrote 10 articles, Publications 0 Teus Tuinenburg Tuinenburg released 0 publications

    Searching Falsifications in my perception of pneumatic conveying

    Know-How Conveying (1374) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 1374 times, Pneumatic Conveying (1179) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 1179 times, Pneumatic (45) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 45 times

    Dear Mr Panos,

    Attached your 1.000.000 tons cement terminal?

    ( A little bit copying and pasting)

    success
    Teus
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Teus

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by panos View Post
    Very basic info about unloading Cement and transfer to silos

    Dear All,

    I need a very-very rough estimate of a setup where ships carrying bulk cement dust are to be unloaded and then cement is to be transferred to silos.

    The cost request is about the
    1. Unloading mechanism (vacuum),
    2. the conveying
    3 and finally the silos.

    The unloading rate should be in the area of a 30 ton ship in approx two to three days.
    And the silos capacity must be approx 100.000mt.

    I know that for a precise calculation a lot of more input is needed, but I don't have the extra input right now and the rough estimate must be there.

    So, any help is greatly appreciated.

    Regards

    Panos
    Dear Panos, It is impossible to give you rough estimates for the system because first of all you have not given the entire input/data and secondaly selection of equipment and system for the same is very essential,for example cost difference between flat cement storage system and silo storage system is 5-6 times,so first of all select the system and equipment then proceed for this project.

    Regards, Anil Seth
    Director
    Libran Engineering& Services, India
    www.libranengineering.com

  10. #10
    Teus Tuinenburg

    Professional Experience 50 Years / 8 Month Teus Tuinenburg has 50 Years and 8 Month professional experience

    Discussions 1805 Teus Tuinenburg acceded to 1805 discussions, Articles 10 Teus Tuinenburg wrote 10 articles, Publications 0 Teus Tuinenburg Tuinenburg released 0 publications

    Searching Falsifications in my perception of pneumatic conveying

    Know-How Conveying (1374) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 1374 times, Pneumatic Conveying (1179) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 1179 times, Pneumatic (45) Teus Tuinenburg used this tag 45 times

    Dear Mr Panos,

    I understand the need for starting information in order to do a feasibility study for an intended project.

    One approach is to (roughly) design, specify the installation, and then ask for price indications from appropriate vendors.
    This approach might end in a no go.

    If this work can be avoided by a pre-assumption of the order of magnitude of the involved investment, it would be very welcome.
    At the same time, a wrong pre estimate can destroy a project also unnecessarily in an early stage.

    Another approach is to execute an economical calculation based on the intended trade and derive the possible investment cost that can be absorbed by the turnover of the trade.
    That (back) calculated investment is available for the building cost of the terminal.
    Such a calculation can also reveal the need for a phased approach, whereby the terminal is started small with the possibility to be extended later on.

    A quick estimate of the possible capital cost can be made as follows:

    Assume Euro 10.00 per handled ton of cement for capital cost.
    That gives 10 * 1000000 = Euro 10.000.000 per year.
    With a return of investment time of 10 years, this results in approx Euro 100.000.000 as available investment.
    ( I expect the real investment will be in the same order, whereby the pneumatic unloading and conveying installation amounts to a fraction of approx. 10%)
    Be aware that an investment estimate is highly depending on the local circumstances s.a. material cost, labor cost and geographical conditions. Building a silo in soft soil is more expensive than on rock.

    You have to repeat a similar calculation, using your own figures and calculation methods.

    The next step will be a rough design (and there you will need the OVERALL experts) and the various offers of the manufacturers to determine a more precise investment.
    Once entered this phase of the project, it evolves by itself with more details, modifications, set backs, extra cost, savings, negotiations, meetings, conflicting information, self-centered technical engineers of different technologies, etc.

    Top sport for the project manager

    Success
    Teus
    Teus

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